[Question #10664] Hypotheticals Gonorrhea
21 months ago
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1) Risk of gonorrhea from protected (covered) BJ from CSW and they used mouth to apply condom? % risk assuming unknown carrier status? % risk making assumption CSW has pharyngeal gonorrhea. I have read no real risk, but would like peace of mind
2) No symptoms apart from tingling, urgency, more frequent urination starting 1 month after exposure. Any concerns? HIGH levels of anxiety (suspect CPPS)
3) If someone has untreated gonorrhea (how common is this btw?) can it resolve on its own with time? If so, what are the stats? Is there "latent" asymptomatic gonorrhea a real thing?
4) after possible exposure, took Augmentin for sinus infection. Would this have any benefit or unlikely?
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H. Hunter Handsfield, MD
21 months ago
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Welcome to the forum. I'll try to help, but I would put the stress on "hypotheticals" in the title your chose for your question. The data on which to answer your first question are scanty indeed. But the bottom line is that there is no realistic possibility you have gonorrhea.
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1) I agree with your own statement: "no real risk". More detail: The large maority of urethral (penile) gonorrhea from oral sex occurs in men who have sex with men. Among women, including the most sexually active (like CSWs), under 1% have oral gonorrhea at any point in time. When oral gonorrhea is present, the transmission risk to the urethra from one episode of unprotected oral sex probably is around 5%. So even without a condom, that translates to a risk of maybe 0.01 x 0.05 = 0.0005, or one chance in 2,000. Condoms lower the risk nearly completely, but let's say there's still a 1% chance of transmission. That would reduce your risk by 99%, i.e. to one chance in 200,000. I trust you'll agree that's consistent with "no real risk"!
2) I agree these symptoms do not suggest gonorrhea or any other urethral infection.
3) "How common" untreated gonorrhea might be is unanswerable, but I've given you my guesstimate of 1% of female CSWs having oral gonorrhea. In the population as a whole, probably under one person in a thousand has gonorrhea of any anatomic site. And yes, gonorrhea always is cured by the immune system over time, typically within a few weeks for male urethral (penile) infection, a few months for infections of the cervix (women) and rectum (gay men, some women). And indeed asymptomatic gonorrhea is a "real thing" but it's rare. (This is somehting I know a lot about. Here's a link to what is still the main research on the topic, even though it's now nearly 50 years old: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/4202519/ But for a variety of reasons, it's much less common than in our study all those years ago.)
4) Taken soon after exposure, Augmentin would be nearly 100% effective in preventing gonorrhea from taking hold.
Considering all these issues, the chance you have gonorrhea is zero. You should not be tested or at all worried.
I hope these comments are helpful. Let me know if anything isn't clear.
HHH, MD
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21 months ago
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1) Does the fact she briefly used her mouth (externally on top) to place condom affect much? I believe you have said it is not so much the saliva but rather direct mucosal contact (urethra on pharynx) that does the transmission
2) Thanks
3) Sorry, I meant how common is asymptomatic, but you answered that. And if Gonorrhea is always cured by the immune system, "chronic" gonorrhea is not possible? What about incidence of DGI, are those not cases where it is not effectively cleared by immune system? Or is that uncommon and usually in context of immunodeficiency? I read abstract of article - first line: "Urethral gonococcal infection was detected in 40 per cent of asymptomatic male contacts of women with symptomatic gonorrhea." Does that not fly against what you mentioned? That seems quite high? Again, did not read whole article, just abstract.
4) What is considered soon? Within a couple days? Week? The dose was 500mg amox/clav TID for 7 days
Very much appreciate your final sentiment
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H. Hunter Handsfield, MD
21 months ago
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1) There are no data on STD risk in relation to oral condom application, but I don't see that it would signficantly elevate the risk of infection.
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3) Chronic gonorrhea is not a standard medical term. If someone has gonorrhea for say 6 months before the immune system clears it, I suppose the last couple months could be called "chronic". But if you're asking if there are longstanding cases that continue indefinitely, the answer is that this isn't known to happen. Even in the pre-antibiotic era, all cases eventually cleared up. There are few if any immune deficiencies that results in abnormally prolonged bacterial (as opposed to viral) infections.
Did you notice the authors of the article you quote on asymptomatic gonorrhea? https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/4202519/. It's still considered the most important scientific paper on asymptomatic urethral gonorrhea, even though it's nearly 50 years old) -- but that statement reflects research in a highly selected population, in an era when certain strains of gonorrhea -- more likely than others to cause asymptomatic infection in males -- were much more common than today. (Such strain differences were unknown when it was written.*) In addition, "asymptomatic" doesn't imply long lasting or chronic. Most men with asymptomatic urethral gonorrhea initially go on to develop symptoms soon; and other cases clear up promptly.
4) "Soon" referred to starting after exposure, not the duration of treatment. That dose would have been effective.
2) Thanks for the thanks!
* Among the asymptomatic men with follow-up from 7 to 165 days, ten years later the saved strains were tested and the guy tested and still positive at 165 days turned out to have a new strain. The original one had cleared up on its own and he had then been reinfected with gonorrhea.
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21 months ago
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Just getting my monies worth before thread is closed. You must feel like more of a psychologist/psychiatrist than an infectious disease doc. I apologize, but appreciate the peace of mind you provide.
1)What is the evidence based incubation period of gonorrhea? I believe you have stated generally 2-5 days to maybe a little longer. Some sources (I know, I know, careful what you read) state it can be months. If it is over 6 weeks post exposure with no symptoms, is it safe to say it is unlikely to have the infection? At what time point can you assume - all clear?
2) Is it safe to say, in the hypothetical situation someone does acquire gonorrhea, is asymptomatic thus never seeks testing or treatment, it is an almost absolute certainty the bacteria will eventually get cleared by the immune system within a time frame? Several months? Again, the damn internet tells me the gonorrhea will NOT go away on its own without treatment, and you are a ticking time bomb for DGI and life changing side effect. If there is any uncertainty and testing is not a feasible option, simply abstaining from any sex for many months can almost ensure future contacts would be safe? It is not going to lie dormant waiting to pop out and ruin ones life
3) In the remote chance that syphillis was contacted, would, 7 day course of TID Augmentin within a week or two of experience reliably prevent it?
4) Physical contact (ie handjob or more specifically titjob (frottage) essentially carries zero risk for gonorrhea, chlamydia, NGU, and Trich. Small risk for HPV, HIV and syphillis correct?
That is all from me, thank you and you are doing a great service. PLease close this after answering
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H. Hunter Handsfield, MD
21 months ago
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1) Years of clinical experience and a few published studies. I can't state a particular source off the top of my head, but you could find it among the reference list in the main gonorrhea chapter (which I co-wrote) in the main STD textbook https://www.amazon.com/Sexually-Transmitted-Diseases-Fourth-Holmes/dp/0071417486/
2) I agree with your "almost absolute certainty" statement. You'll avoid much of the misinformation online by limiting searching to sites run by academic and public health agencies and/or professionally monitored, and avoid those by and for people with particular problems or at risk (like Reddit, for example). I cannot imagine a situation in which "testing is not a feasible option", but if somehow that were the case (living in a tree house in Cameroon?), abstaining from sex of course would assure nobody was at risk of catching it.
3) Yes, augmentin in that dose would be 100% effective in aborting incubating syphilis.
4) Those practices are risk free for all STDs. Any theoretical risk for those transmitted skin to skin is too low to be considered a reality.
Thanks for the thanks. I'm glad to have helped.
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