[Question #12675] Herpes Onset?

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6 months ago
I am MSM and received oral from 2 known regulars two days in a row about 8-9 days ago and have some questions on how herpes would present itself. They say clean, passed latest tests and no symptoms.
It started 1 day after the encounters i started to feel dysuria, guilt struck me and started checking genitals continuously. Have had this previously after oral, got tested and everything was clean. Went on a weekend trip then with my normal partner thinking all was well and rough unprotected oral and vaginal sex 5-6 times in 2days. She is confirmed no STI and I was as of early November. Walking around a lot in humid heat and thousands of people were at this location, I noticed Sunday what looked like a singular pin size flesh colored bump with tiny blonde hair redness behind it on the skin. No clustering or blisters/fluid. Some redness spots around base of shaft also around some longer hair follicles. Continued on my next, as I cant finish this for some reason. 
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6 months ago
That irritation showed and got better by the next day and the pin size area bump looked like it had sort of a blackhead/scab on it and has looked that way for about 2 days now. No pain, no burning at the location at all. After I noticed that I abstained from sex and my partner actually started to get recurrent tonsilitis (she does get this ocasionally). Some questions I have are as follows:

1) Can dysuria be an initial symptom with no other lesions, abrasions, etc.? I was checking like all the time and didnt notice until 2 days after dysuria seemed to clear. 
2) If it was a herped bump, could it be singular like that, color of the skin with no fluid and go to a blackhead/scab that quickly in less than a day?
3) My partner got tonsilitis from the trip and on Z pak, prednisone. Any correlation to this symptom and could be herpes passing as first symptom?
4) My understanding is herpes virus on initial OB always starts where it entered the body, is that true? Trying to ensure if condoms would protect the shaft from transmission, obviously other parts. 

I just got full panel STI testing and awaiting results, would love to hear your thoughts and also next steps you would think? 

Mind is racing after I thought when the dysuria left had nothing going on like before.
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6 months ago
5) One more I forgot, if I truly had this, could I have passed this on that quickly to my partner if we didnt have sex prior to any bump?
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Terri Warren, RN, Nurse Practitioner
6 months ago
I seriously doubt that your symptoms are due to HSV as the lesion doesn't sound anything like herpes to me.  An HSV lesion would be a water blister, would not go away in a single day.  Yes, HSV would show up the first time where it entered the body.  
For the record, STI panels do not usually include HSV testing due to the high rate of false positives on the HSV 2 IgG tests.
If this was brand new herpes, which I don't believe it was, it could be passed prior to the development of a lesion, yes

Terri
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6 months ago
Unfortunately, I got it swabbed and found that we both have herpes. Waiting swab results on which type, etc. They gave us medication to take for 10 days. 

So I had some questions in regards to this. 

1) Would seroconversion symptoms like sore throat, chills, tonsillitis with burning in my feet (this is quite noticeable at night) and reddish rash on my chest be normal or is this something more sinister like HIV? I am starting to really worry about that because of what I read on the internet and the timing.

2) I am waiting on my full panel testing including HIV RNA test which was 13 days post exposure. Everything negative so far, even the herpes, but I understand it’s a fresh infection and wouldn’t show. If I had HIV seroconversion, would the oraquick tests be accurate instead of waiting?

3) Is there any advice on what to do treating herpes even after this first 10 days of treatment? Do we take pills for rest of our lives every day?

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6 months ago
And as a follow on, is an HIV RNA test only checking for HIV antibodies or could it be “tricked” false positive by my Herpes active infection? I am terrified of that…
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Terri Warren, RN, Nurse Practitioner
6 months ago
No, the testing would be separate for those two  viruses.  One does not trip the test for the other.
I'm a little confused, you posted one day ago with a single flesh colored bump, then less than 24 hours later you had results of a positive swab test for HSV without typing?  And you both had swab tests to determine that quickly that you both had HSV ? 
A red rash on your chest is not associated with genital herpes.  Tonsillitis could be related to HSV if there was oral sex involved and HSV was transmitted in this way.
I'm going to let Dr Handsfield answer your questions about HIV.
In order to tell you more about HSV, I would need to know the type isolated on the swab test.  HSV 1 and HSV 2 genitally are very different infections.


Terri
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6 months ago
My partner got the swab done and the doctor said it is herpes, she developed sores, we don’t know which type it is yet. Said in 2-3 days. I still have the one sore looking one but they gave us both the herpes medicines alredy and we have taken them. 

Burning, tingling and peripheral neuropathy has gotten really bad for me in the feet and I see what looks sort of like redness on my upper chest, not like a true rash with boils, etc. the skin just looks a little redder. Not sure if all of that is seroconversion symptoms or first time break out? Or sides of the medication we just started today?

I will update once I know which type we have in the next days. I hope I have rest of my std panel back tomorrow as well, I just have some questions about hiv seroconversion as I have these symptoms and I have topped before but always with condom.
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H. Hunter Handsfield, MD
6 months ago
Hello again. I've been following your discussion with Terri. The rash you describe and your other symptoms are not at all typical of acute retroviral syndrome (ARS, i.e. a new HIV infection). ARS also does not cause symptoms like peripheral neuropathy. Therefore, I expect your HIV RNA PCR test to be negative. (It is not an antibody test; as the name implies, it detects HIV RNA, i.e. the virus itself.)

Like Terri, I'm also confused about your herpes tests so far. Above you say that some tests showed "everything" negative. Did that include a negative HSV blood test? If so, then a positive swab test for HSV is a recently acquired infection. And maybe you then infected your regular (female?) partner. Can you clarify your partner(s) in the last 3-4 weeks and the kinds of exposures (vaginal, oral, etc) with each one? 

HHH, MD

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6 months ago
Hello, sorry it got confusing. I have topped with condom in the last 3-4 weeks males and I received unprotected oral approximately 2 weeks ago with 2 known regular people I engage with. I always ask if they are ddf and on prep prior, but I have been strict about condom usage when topping and also after check really closely after that there was no condom breakage as I have had this before and took pep as a precaution. Approximately 8 months ago is when that happened. I have taken tests every few months and my last test at start of November was all negative for a full 10 panel. 

My female partner got lesions and then I noticed the bumps I spoke about as well that didnt look like Herpes. We both went to get looked at and tested and they swabbed her fully, told us we probably both have herpes based on the look and when it came on and gave us the Valtrex to take for 10 days. 

I took a 10 panel test again on Wednesday and everything negative, except the pending gono, chlamydia and HIV RNA testing. With the flu like symptoms and reddening of chest I am now worried its more sinister than herpes like HIV, although my understanding I had zero risk by using condoms and conferring with partners they were on prep. 

So I wanted to know if this could be due to that and while waiting for RNA, get an oraquick test because if I truly had ARS symptoms, then the oraquick would detect this. And secondly, if indeed it is only herpes we contracted freshly, would that impact the oraquick and possibly strike a "false positive" for HIV, not sure if that looks for specific HIV antibodies or just antibodies for an infection?
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Terri Warren, RN, Nurse Practitioner
6 months ago
Do you know, in your 10 panel test, was HSV 1 included as well as HSV 2?  We are thinking perhaps you acquired HSV 1 when you received oral sex from one of your regular partners?  Were those contacts unprotected?  Do you know anything about their HSV status?  Your HSV 1 test in the panel, if you had one done, could be negative because you have a new infection and it is too early to have made antibody detected by the test OR the IgG missed an HSV 1 infection that is more longstanding - the HSV 1 IgG test misses 30% of HSV 1 infections compared to the western blot, the gold standard.  You may wish to confirm with the person who swab tested you both that if the sample is positive, that it get typed as well (HSV 1 vs. HSV 2).  We are finished with this series of posts now, you can always make another post if you wish. Alternatively, I could talk more with you at westoverheights.com, on the herpes forum there.
Best,
Terri Warren
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