[Question #12792] Potential late ARS
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5 months ago
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Greetings Doctor,
I had a full body massage with mineral oil on Saturday 30th November 2024, after which there was protected vaginal intercourse for 1.5-2 minutes. However the masseuse used mineral oil on top of condom before insertion which I recently found out can degrade latex and cause small microscopic holes in it's structure allowing the 0.1 micron HIV virus to pass through and despite the condom not breaking after ejaculating and pulling out, it's effectively useless due to being broken down.
I had been healthy until the 10th of march 2025 which is approximately 100 days after my exposure. On that day I developed fatigue and low grade fever which never went above 99.6 F and fluctuated between 98.8 to 99.6 till even today. It was accompanied by muscle pains particularly my glutes and calves as well as forearms and hamstrings. The muscle aches are 90% better. I also had a mild sore throat with minimal cough without a runny nose. Yesterday on the 16th of march 2025 I started azithromycin which has improved my sore throat by about 80%. Now I am dealing with fatigue and mild 99F off and on fever.
After doing some research it seems these are text book / typical ARS symptoms i.e not having runny nose or high grade fever means I am a late seroconverter and only now I am getting antibodies to presence of HIV. These "typical" symptoms feel too real to not be ARS as I've never had these kind of focused muscular pains and heaviness ever without any running nose.
Needless to say my mind is running on overdrive and I require a rational perspective to aid my anxiety to a practical level. I do understand many conflicting resources are available on the internet and have done me no good.
Looking forward to your response doctor.
Thank you
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5 months ago
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Apologies for the addon comment but I did also have a small penile HPV wart at that time midway on the shaft which was covered by condom. Google also says there is increased risk of contracting HIV by a factor of 3-5 times if you have active warts. I had treated that wart on December 10th without recurrence as of yet.
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Edward W. Hook M.D.
5 months ago
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Welcome to the Forum. Thanks for your questions and possibly your confidence in our service. I am confident that the symptoms you describe are not the cause of your symptoms. Google may not have been your friend here- much of what is said there is incorrect, either because it is out of date, taken out of context, or just plain wrong.
The encounter you describe was a virtually no risk event. While petroleum products do degrade latex, what they do to condoms is increase the risk of breakage. There are no solid data that the degradation process created the microscopic holes you describe to increase risk for HIV.
Your flu-like symptoms are not due to "late ARS". Both "late seroconversion" and "delayed ARS" are internet-based myths which have lingered far, far after they have been proven to not exist. The ARS occurs when antibodies are beginning to be produced and interact with the HIV virus, events which occur within a few weeks of acquistion of infection, not months later. The symptoms of the ARS are shared by a number of other viral illnesses including COVID, influenza, and a long list of other community acquired viral illnesses such as those most people get from time to time. You can prove to yourself that you do not have HIV by testing. Persons experiencing the ARS always have positive tests.
The data that persons with warts are 3-5 times more susceptible to HIV than persons without HPV infection is likewise incorrect. EWH
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5 months ago
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Thank you for the detailed reply Dr Hook it has helped alleviate my concerns.
From my understanding 99% of people who would have had ARS would have done so within 4-6 weeks at the maximum ?
Regards
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Edward W. Hook M.D.
5 months ago
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You are correct. If the ARS has occurred more than 30 days after acquistion of infection, I am unaware of it. EWH---
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5 months ago
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Appreciated Dr hook. I feel much more confident with my experience. Bless you for the prompt responses.
Cheers
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4 months ago
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Dear Dr Hook,
Apologies for posting again but if you can look past the absurdity of my actions in the following account I'm sure you will see the logic behind them.
I ordered a large box of condoms the same brand which was used in my experience with the massage parlor worker. They are iso certified and a well known local brand.
I then profusely lubricated my genitals with mineral/baby oil and covered it with the above brand condoms. After that I applied a good quantity of same oil on the condom and used a toy/device to ejaculation. The overall idea was to recreate an average sexual experience but with more vigor during this phase and about 40-45 min total use, which was far higher than my 2 minute exposure in my original post. There was no breakage in the condom.
I then filled it with a decent amount of water which did not leak. The overall structure of the condom also appeared more or less intact. I then tied it well and kept the condom filled with water in different areas for three days and didn't observe any bursting despite the varied temperatures/positions etc. I did not notice any overt/ visible leakage on it's surface even when inspected beneath a flash light.
It was able to withstand aforementioned for about three days until it burst on a tad bit more pressure unfortunately.
Based on my observations I can conclude that protection was probably offered adequately.
Given these findings and the fact that my sore throat recovered along with every other symptom in 24 hours after first dose oral azithromycin, should I let my concern for HIV drift a bit towards the back of my mind ?
Thank you
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Edward W. Hook M.D.
3 months ago
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Yes, you should have moved on long ago. Sorry for the delayed response.
This thread will now be closed. EWH
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