[Question #3877] Sleazy massage parlor

86 months ago

Hi. Two questions. Went to massage places on two occasions. No sex (no oral, anal vaginal sex). First time, nothing weird. Normal massage. Touched balls, no handjob. 4 weeks later had strange rash confined to left leg. Very itchy, scaley and hot. Knee hurt a little. Lasted almost 4 weeks. Dermatologist said psoriasis and said it did not look like ARS. No other symptoms. Worried about std/hiv risk.

Did not inspect masseuses hands for cuts, scratches, etc.

Second incident. Went for “table shower.” Lay face down on table in the nude. Masseuse sprayed table down with water. She put water and soap on hands and washed butt crack a few times quickly. No insertion of finger. Did not inspect hands for scrapes, blood, etc. Came home and had bowel movement. Saw two small red dots on toilet paper. Don’t think she touched me in that area. No symptoms afterwards.

Please assess risk for hiv/std

86 months ago

I should also add that I uploaded a picture of the rash (mostly around knee and ankles) and submitted the question to a doctor - I think she was Indian and her ENGLISH skills were poor. She told me that she had clients that caught STDs off of towels and bedsheets and therefor told me to test for literally HPV, HIV. I read that towels and sheets don’t transmit STDs according to the CDC. I see a lot of conflicting information.

Edward W. Hook M.D.

86 months ago

Welcome to the Forum. I'll do my best to try to help address your concerns. The events you describe - massage including genital contact, a table shower and rectal contact are absolutely no risk events with no risk whatsoever for HIV or for other STIs. The idea that STIs, including HIV can be transmitted by hand to genital contact or transfer of genital secretions on one person's hands to another is a longstanding urban myth which is all too widely held. It is also categorically and unequivocally wrong. the doctor you spoke with was mis-informed. There is no need for concern about STIs and no need for testing.

The rash that you describe does not raise concern about any STI.

I hope this information is helpful. If any part of this is unclear please feel free to use your up to two follow-up questions to seek clarification. EWH

---

86 months ago

Thanks. I’m grappling with guilt over these indiscretions. I suppose the logic is:

1) chances she has HIV 1/1000; less if she does restricts her activity to hand/genital contact with clients.

2) chances she was bleeding 1/100 - 1/1000

3) chances soap or water or soap would not have killed residual bleeding on her finger 1/100. Part of me thinks that no masseuse legit or shady, would deliberately bleed all over a customer. That seems like a tall order. To suggest otherwise implies malicious intent. Maybe someone with a healing paper cut at best.

4) chances that people get hiv from hand to anus contact. No data. 1 chance in a million, maybe more.

Risk is just too low to worry about. 1 chance in many millions.

Does this seem logical?

Edward W. Hook M.D.

86 months ago

I think your logic is fine and if it helps you that's great. At the same time, also please understand that despite 30 years of intensive study on HIV transmission, there has NEVER been a proven case of HIV acquired through hand to genital contact. thus the practical experience with the disease is similar to your conclusion- no case of infection has occurred despite many millions (or even billions) of contacts similar to yours. EWH
---

86 months ago

My last question is about the strength of skin to keep out infections. Based on my readings, skin keeps out infections, but some skin is stronger or thicker in other parts of the body. To clarify the women touched the skin outside anal crack (beyond the anal verge is the rectum?) - how strong is the skin outside the anal verge? You read about microabrasions. I have had hemorrhoids (but nothing active as I could tell in this case). I keep generally very clean in this area. I don’t itch much in that area. You said no risk whatsoever - I’m just look for further understanding and insight. Also, do no symptoms after the table shower incident further suggest that no STIs occurred

Edward W. Hook M.D.

86 months ago

I am sorry that the two no risk events you described above continue to worry you. You are correct that the skin on different parts of the body varies in its thickness and resistance to abrasion. The thickest skin on the body is on the hands and soles of the feet. Thin, relatively easily abraded skin is on areas like Head of the penis. The skin of the anus and around the rectum is a normal fitness and relatively resistant to infection.

Having another person touch this area, even if they happen to have infected genital secretions on their hend remains a no risk event. There are no reports of proven infection being transmitted through person on one person's hand to another person during mutual masturbation. Each of the events you have described remains an absolutely no risk event. There is no need for concern and no need for testing.

I hope that my comments have been helpful to you and will allow you to move forward without continuing concern. This is my third reply to your questions. As per forum guidelines this thread will be closed in a few hours without additional responses for me. Take care and please don't worry. EWH

---