[Question #7232] Oral lesions-Syphillis

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60 months ago
Hello. I have recently remembered that there was a period of time in which I developed some strange and unusual oral lesion on and behind my bottom lip. The ones on the inner part of my bottom lip were like whitish patches. They looked exactly like mucous patches associated with secondary syphillis. The ones on my lips were ulcerated. I’ve had bumps and lesions on my lips before but these were very different and weird. I remember that my lips and/or mouth hurt, a pain I had never experienced before. The oral lesions went away on their own after a few weeks..  I’m scared because this was also around the same time that my boyfriend developed a non-itchy/non-painful rash eruption on the soles of his feet. Can mucous patches be anything other than Syphillis? Can they appear during the “latent” stage or it be a “relapse”? Is it possible for syphillis to be in an active state for such a short period of time so as that the blood tests don’t pick it up? I truly feel that something was there. My first initial screening done 1 year and 10 months after very high risk encounters  (unprotected sex with someone who had a firm pink bump on genitalia) was “equivocal”. The subsequent tests have been negative.  My bf did some pre-op/pre-surgery bloodwork yesterday which I believe included  std tests (not sure). Results won’t be in until next week.   Thank you again for your attention and advise. 
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H. Hunter Handsfield, MD
60 months ago
Welcome back to the forum, although I'm sorry you continue to worry about syphilis despite Dr. Hook's reasoned, science based reassurance in your two previous threads -- which I have read.

The aspect that is obsessing you apparently is the equivocal IgG/IgM blood test. Many IgM tests for various infections carry high potential for false positive results. For reasons related to the nature of IgM molecules, it's quite hard to engineer IgM tests without risk of false positve resutls. (In the STI field, it's especially a problem for herpes blood tests, but it occurs with all IgM tests.) Almost certainly that's what was going on. In any case, the initial screening test is never definitive. Your subsequent confirmatory blood tests prove you do not have syphilis. These results are much more accurate than symptoms to judge presence or absence of syphilis. And in any case, syphilis would not likely cause oral ulcers or mucous patches as the only symptom. But even if your symptoms were typical for syphilis, it wouldn't matter: the test results overrule all else. And no, there is no such thing as "syphillis to be in an active state for such a short period of time so as that the blood tests don’t pick it up". 

I'm not saying you didn't have "something", but there are many other potential causes of every symptom you describe. And your negative test results overrule any and all symptoms you have had before, have now, or might develop in the future. conclusively exclude syphilis. And on top of all this, you actually do not describe a sexual encounter that seems high risk for syphilis. I don't know where you are, but in the US and most industrialized countries, syphilis is extremely rare in hetosexual males, and certianly plenty of other things are much more likely causes of "a firm pink bump" in the genital area.

So my advice is to repeat Dr. Hook's:  There is simply no chance you have syphilis. Assuming no future exposures to it, any and every symptom you develop in the future -- no matter how similar to syphilis it might be -- will be caused by something else. Do your best to stop worrying about syphilis and stop testing for it. 

I hope these comments help you finally put these issues behind you. Let me know if anything isn't clear.

HHH, MD
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60 months ago
Thank you so much for your response.  I was extremely worried because I have read that sometimes  for certain individuals, mucous patches can be the only sign of secondary Syphillis.  I definitely had them. Sometime prior to the oral lesions, also had that very weird and strange blotchy macular dark red/brown evanescent palm rash.  I’ve read about the Prozone phenomenon causing false negatives in tests.  In which instances would this phenomenon be seen? Can’t help thinking of this possibility because my bf’s rash on the bottom of his feet looked just like the Syphillis sole rash images shown  on the internet (it’s faded away now). I know he could have only caught something from me.  He also had what looked like a chancre on his ankle (popped up when had sole rash). Your response did make me feel somewhat calmer though. Will try to control myself and not re-test. 
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60 months ago
Forgot to mention that the pink/red “bump” on the genitalia from the “exposure” incidents, was round, kinda like a button. Ever since then, all of the unusual Syphillis like symptoms emerged. Stuff I’ve never experienced before. I need to keep re-reading your response and Dr. Hooks to calm my anxiety. Cause I keep thinking that the “equivocal” result did pick  it, or “something “ up.  I guess I just need to focus on the subsequent negative results. Yes, I live in the USA (when you were mentioning before how uncommon it is here). 
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H. Hunter Handsfield, MD
60 months ago
You cannot say you "definitely" had mucous patches from self exam. But even if you had what looked typical, the negative blood tests prove it wasn't syphilis. Prozone only applies to the RPR and VDRL tests, not to any others; and virtually all labs routinely take precautions against prozone (which is a very simple, cost-free tweak to the test). There must be a hundred skin rashes that "look like syphilis" but are not. There is no reason to suppose your partner's rash is syphilis. But of course he could always be tested if it would make you (and him) feel better about it. I have no other comments about the penile "bump".

I'm glad we've helped your anxiety. You definitely can relax. There's nothing more you're likelyt to think of that has any chance of changing my advice on all this!
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60 months ago
Thank you so much! This site and all of yours and Dr. Hook’s immense knowledge have been of great help and support.  Very appreciative of it. 
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H. Hunter Handsfield, MD
60 months ago
Thanks for the thanks. That's why we're here! But please be aware that repeated questions on the same topic are discouraged, and when they continue are at risk for being deleted without reply (and without refund of the posting fee). ASHA is not keen on continuing to collect fees from anxious persons who are going to simply get the same advice repeated, and such questions have little educational value for other users, one of the goals of the forum. If you find yourself still worried, with a "yes but" or "could I be the exception" sort of concern, I would advise re-reading all three of your forum threads: almost certainly anything else that comes to mind has already been addressed. Thanks for your understanding.---