[Question #9543] Question about HIV antibodies
31 months ago
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I have been volunteering in a shelter for battered women for awhile now and sometimes I feel like some of the information being given out is confusing me and I am not sure if I am ever asked how best to answer the question. One thing I have heard a couple of times now that if someone with HIV is on medicine and their viral load becomes undetectable they will test negative, yet when they get tested for for HIV antibodies the screening test that is done they are always positive. I did some research and I just wanted to see if this statement is accurate: Once you get HIV you will always test positive for HIV antibodies for life, but on medicine you can get tested for viral load (a different test) and that can become undetectable. So when we tell people in this situation that they are negative it means their viral load is negative so it is unlikely they can transmit the disease - but they will always test positive for HIV antibodies. Is this correct? Does this also apply to other antibodies like HCV and HBV - with HBV the core antibody does that also stay positive for life. Thanks a lot for creating safe spaces for people to ask questons like this, I just want to make sure I understand this, I know I probably will never be asked this because its not my job when I volunteer - but I heard conflicting things and when I did my research this is what I found and I just want to make sure I am up to speed. Thanks in advance.
31 months ago
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sorry made an error in a statement I wanted you to validate for me - HBV core antibodies remain for life, but HCV may or may not last for life, but do last a long time. My main question is below about HIV antibodies. Thank you so much Dr.
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H. Hunter Handsfield, MD
31 months ago
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Welcome. Thank you for your kind words about the forum, and for a thoughtful question. And thank you for your important volunteer work.
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All you learned is exactly right -- good work in your literature searching. But honestly, I'm not sure what the issue or problem is. Health professionals, public health, and HIV infected people -- at least the large majority of them -- do not characterize people as "HIV positive" or "HIV negative" based on any particular test. Once someone has acquired HIV, they have it and that's how they and their doctors view them -- as HIV infected. There is no difference in terminology for those who are antibody positive only, positive for virus in the blood (viral load), or both: all have HIV infection. The only difference is when treatment is effective in reducing viral load to undetectable levels, as it usually is: such persons' sexual and blood-exposed partners are not at risk of infection. But the infected person still has HIV, and may refer to herself or himself as "HIV positive". Certainly nobody would call them "HIV negative". With or without a positive viral load test, people with HIV remain infected for life, and also have HIV antibodies for life.
Does this address your questions or issues in regard to HIV? Please let me know if not, or if I have misunderstood what is on your mind.
Viral hepatitis is different. Whereas HIV is never cured (well, only one or two reported cases), most cases of infection with HBV or HCV are resolved by the immune system, or sometimes by antiviral treatment. Unlike HIV, these persons remain antibody positive, but their negative tests for the virus itself -- i.e. absence of HBV surface antigen in the blood (HBsAg) or by positive PCR for HCV -- show they are cured. Nobody is at risk from sexual, blood, or any other contact with them. But they test antibody positive for life. This is no different than for most infectious diseases: someone who has had tetanus, TB, influenza, or covid-19 tests positive for antibodies to these infections, even though they have been cured.
I hope these comments clarify the issues for you. Let me know if anything isn't clear.
HHH, MD
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31 months ago
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yes this did help - thank you, I asked for my own knowledge bc I heard somebody say they were functionally cured on an intake form and I didn't know what that meant and was to embarrassed to ask the staff bc of looking like an idiot, so I read about myself because I was curious. Thank you for the great answer below, I understand things better now. Thanks for what you do Dr. reading through all the forum responses, its clear you help a great deal of people here and I looked you up and saw how distinguished you are, you have had a wonderful career and should be really proud of what you have done with your life.
31 months ago
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Hep B is the most confusing one - the HBsAG is the antigen right (that can be either positive or negative depending on status) and the antibodies HBsAB and HBcAB are the antibodies and these are the ones that stay positive for life correct?
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H. Hunter Handsfield, MD
31 months ago
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Thanks for the thanks. I'm glad to have helped.
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You correctly understand the meanings of the abbreviations. Hep B surface antigen (HBsAg) is a marker of disease activity. Its presence means the patient is still infected (e.g. if positive after treatment) and, most important, infectious by sex or their blood. The infection may still be active if HBsAg is negative, but not transmissible. However if HBsAb is present, almost always antigen is gone. In that situation, and if HBcAb also is positive, with rare exceptions the infection is gone, leaving behind only the markers of an effective immune response to the infection.
When HBsAb is the only positive marker, almost always it means the patient was vaccinated against HBV and never infected.
Finally, about hepatitis C: it is not an STD in the usual sense. The only sexual transmission scenario is in men having potentially traumatic anal sex with other men. Heterosexual partners of HCV infected persons have no higher risk of infection than anyone else. (One study calculated the transmission risk by unprotected vaginal sex to be once for every 190,000 exposures. That's equivalent to unprotected vaginal sex with HCV infected partners once daily for 520 years before transmission might be expected. In other words, zero for all practical purposes.)
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31 months ago
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last question so HbsAB is the antibody marker of immunity & HBcAB is the marker that an infection occured at some point, so if you were ever exposed to hep b whether you recover or not HBcAB will always be positive, so if the HbsAG is negative from what you said below, the HBcAB would still be positive right, but this person is not infectious, also does the HBcAB then stay for life or decades and decades it can still be detected? I think I read about isolated HBcAB and I think that is what you are refering to - this is also rare correct? Thanks a lot for your time, I'm very inqusitive and just wanted to make sure I understood all this because its very confusing - so is what I wrote above correct? Thanks again Dr, I know you only allow three replies so this will be my last question.
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H. Hunter Handsfield, MD
31 months ago
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By "exposure" I think you mean infection; exposure (without being infected) doesn't produce a positive result for any HBV marker (or any other infection). If HBcAb is positive, it means someone is or has been infected with HBV, and once positive remains positive for life. With negative HBsAg, that person is not infective and usually no longer has active infection. That said, it would be very rare to have only HBcAb; previously and currently infected persons also are positive for HBsAb.
As for "confusing", it really isn't an issue for knowledgeable health care providers. It basically just means that testing for past or current HBV infection means assays for several markers; the combination of results usually allows easy categorization of past vaccination; past or current infection; and if current, infectivity. For the most part, none of this will be important in your volunteer work: if someone has tested positive and asks you how to interpret the results, it would be best to refer her to her personal physician or other health care provider.
That completes the two follow-up exchanges included with each question and so ends this thread. Best wishes and happy new year.
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