[Question #9778] HIV/STD Transmissions at a Gay Bathhouse
29 months ago
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I went to a gay bathhouse in Tokyo, Japan yesterday out of curiosity. although I did not have any kind of physical contact with anyone, I noticed that many people in the bathhouse were having various forms of sex. I entered a steam room and sat down. There was no one in there at the time, but I'm sure there were people having sex in this steam room ten minutes earlier. I am now concerned about contracting HIV due to possible residual bodily fluids on the wooden chair (I don't recall seeing any residual fluids, they may have evaporated) coming into contact with my open skin wound. in fact, I have chronic ringworm-like symptoms in the middle of the upper part of my butt crack (i.e., directly above my anus) that manifest as itching and redness, and I have never had time to see a doctor. I have since carefully repeated the sitting position in the chair, but cannot be sure if that dermatophytosis is in contact with the chair. Besides, I have a raised infection (some pain) on my right calf. I also have a fresh cut on my chin from a razor shave three hours ago, but it is no longer bleeding. I also had an infection on my I am concerned about the probability of getting HIV in this situation. Everything I've found online says that HIV can live longer in a wet environment and can also be contracted through an open wound. I am very worried. I have had symptoms of excessive anxiety before, but I can't judge the risk of this act.
Thank you so much. This is still within 72 hours. Do I need PEP?
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Edward W. Hook M.D.
29 months ago
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Welcome to the Forum- thanks for your confidence in our service. You do not need PEP. Let me explain-
HIV is actually not that easy to acquire- there are NO sexual exposures in which a singe unprotected exposure to an infected, untreated person will lead to infection. Further, non-penetrative exposures such as contact with an infected surface (bench, toilet seat, other) will not result in transmission of infection. The presence of cuts, scrapes or skin rashes does not change that consideration - still no risk.
I see no need for PEP, no need for testing and no scientific or medical need for concern based on the events you describe. I hope that this information will be helpful. EWH
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29 months ago
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Thanks doctor. But I want to know will HIV live in such a moist environment? Since I had rash there. I think this is the case similar to unprotected anal sex. About the discussion of transmission by surface. I wonder whethen the discussion doesn't consider the circumstance that gay sauna is extremely dangerous than ordinary life?
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Edward W. Hook M.D.
29 months ago
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You are mistaken. HIV becomes non- infectious upon contact with the environment outside of the body. No one has ever been infected from contact with infectious material on an inanimate surface such as a bench top or toilet seat. The presence of a rash, cut or scrape in no way changes this. Neither does where the exposure occurs. You are not going to be the first. No change in my assessment. EWH ---
29 months ago
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Thank you, doctor. However, my paranoia has caused one thought to linger in my head: my case is so unique that no expert has ever considered it before when researching. First, it is said that a moist environment allows HIV to survive longer. Second, considering that it occurred in the steam room of a gay bathroom, I think there is a statistically significant probability that the bench had bodily fluids produced by an HIV-infected person over a half-hour period. (Considering the high rate of infection and sexual activity in gay bathrooms). Third, the itchy ulcer in the upper part of my buttock groove was so severe that it was visible to the naked eye and was pink. Will it constitute an open wound if I scratch it from time to time? Finally, although I thought that HIV would quickly become inactive when it leaves the body, I read online that HIV can remain active for days if the conditions are right. I was reminded to think about the case of drug users sharing syringes where the body fluids likewise leave the body, but they still get infected. I know these ideas may seem ridiculous to you, but can you use some examples or anything else to convince me? With highest respect and thanks!
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Edward W. Hook M.D.
29 months ago
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Sigh. You are incorrect and letting your imagination, perhaps fueled by mis-information which is very common on the internet. The HIV pandemic is now more than 40 years old and the topic of transmission through non-penetrative contact with contaminated surfaces such as toilet seats, in saunas and steam rooms is NOT recognized as a meaningful risk. Similarly, surface contamination of rashes, scrapes, and scratches is NOT considered particularly risky.
Your online source stating that HIV remains viable for days "if the conditions are right" is simply not the case in the real world. Certainly using sophisticated detection methods virus can be found but that virus does not cause infection and the FACT is that infections virtually never occur in such circumstances. Similarly, the virus DOES remain infection within the lumen of hollow needles, in large part because in such places it is sheltered from the environment by being WITH the needle.
As you know, we provide up to three responses to each clients questions. This is my 3rd and therefore final response as part of this thread which will be closed shortly. The information provided here is based on our own published scientific research, our reading of the scientific literature throughout the duration of the HIV pandemic, and conversations and information learned at scientific meetings. We have never heard or seen a proven case in which HIV has been acquired through the sort of exposure you describe. If, perhaps based on misinformation you obtain from the internet, you choose to not believe us, that is entirely up to you. AS I have already told you, nothing you describe warrants PEP and if you saw me in my clinic, I would refuse to prescribe it.
I wish you the best. EWH
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